In a one hour interview at his office in Asmara earlier this month, the President of Eritrea, Mr. Isaias Afeworki said that although the real issue behind the current conflict is not very clear to everyone, partly due to a lot of sensationalization by the media which obscured the real story behind the conflict, he believes that "ultimately truth will prevail and that is what is happening now."

The following is an excerpt from the interview. A video of the interview is now available from Eritrean embassies, consulates and offices throughout Canada and the United States. The interview with the President is for a docmentary on Eritrea now under production.

On the media's portrayal of the conflict as a fight over "barren, useless land"

I do not think that it is a deliberate (misrepresentation), but it is an unfortunate case where people miss the point and forget history. The first world war was instigated by a very small incident. A number of wars we have seen have not been fought for resources. It is partly a problem of cultures, in my opinion. It (Eritrea's stand on the conflict) is a matter of principles, it is a matter of justice, it is a matter of fairness. I think it (the media's portrayal of the conflict) is a biased attitude influenced by modern western culture that values everything in terms of money.

On the international community' and the media's "confusion" on the conflict

I think the fact that it came as a surprise could have contributed to the misunderstanding and the confusion we see these days. The background is misunderstood. It is partly because of our making. We have tried to resolve this matter bilateraly without blowing it out of proportion, and that took everyone by surprise. Number two is the deliberate misinformation that confused people. The Federal Government in Ethiopia knowing that it does not have any valid case or arguments as far as the border issue is concerned wanted to complicate the matter by raising an irrelevant issue and even that issue is not well understood. The background of that story is not very clear to everyone and is partly due to a lot of sensationalization by the media which obscured the real story behind the conflict. Here I would like to state the fact that ultimately truth will prevail and that is what is happening now.

On the real story behind the conflict

We have clearly defined boundaries which are respected and recognized by everybody. International law recognizes that fact. The elite of Tigray have this baggage of feeling inferior, marginalized and wanting to assert itself by expanding territory, by controlling territory. That is what has happened in Ethiopia. It is unfortunate it happened on the border with Eritrea. But it is a trend of a very medievalist sort of attitude in my opinion that has caused the border issue. I mean gradually encroaching, expelling people, resettling people, looking into a map and trying to expand this map as much as possible.

On whether this is a new trend

We wanted to believe that we were on the right track. We did not want to look into the negative aspect of the attitude. It has been there all along, all the way. I have tried to give an historic explanation to this trend. Yes, the people of Tigray have always been marginalized, especially at the end of the 19th century, the first half of the 20th century, given the political developments in Ethiopia, this feeling was there. We cannot deny that was a reality, marginalized in all aspects of life in Ethiopia and even the revolt that was called Weyane in 1943 was a manifestation of this sentiment in Tigray. I think the elite interpreted this sentiment in its own way and came up with a program.

The inception (of the TPLF) was a confused inception, where the elite within the TPLF or those who claim to have founded the TPLF began entertaining funny ideas about Tigray and about the territories of Tigray. It was there very clearly in the program of 1976 for the TPLF. I always said that was infantile, a childish approach for dealing with problems. Yes history was there but to think you can assert oneself by expanding territory and controlling people, it is like repeating the same mistake the Amharas did. It is like repeating the same mistake done elsewhere. If you feel subjugated you can not possibly think of subjugating others and controlling others. I think that tendency was a very dangerous tendency. Even though there were latent trends within the TPLF, our assumption was that it was resolved. We felt that we did go through a very difficult time to persuade our friends in the TPLF that this is not a valid program. It is not a valid tendency.

Yes, the program was changed but then again the confusion continued. The commitment to Ethiopia and the commitment to Tigray was what created the ambivalence within the elite of TPLF. They never were committed towards Ethiopia all the way. I do not think they are committed now to Ethiopia. It is half and half commitment in my opinion. This sort of ambivalence and confusion in the attitude yes obscured and blurred this trend, but when the TPLF got hold of Ethiopia, that dream again surfaced. It is a relapse in my opinion. I can not say it has never been there. It was there all the way.

On whether any aspect of the conflict came as a surprise

No, no. Our attitude was a problem. That is what we did as a mistake.. That may be a mistake. We have always been very frank, very open we have tried not to see the ugly aspect of this trend even though it was always there, it was never hidden. For someone very far away, for someone who does not really know the inside of the story it might have come as a total surprise. For us it was not a surprise. The problem was we never wanted to see this negative aspect of the trend. We always felt history and time will change that, and definitely attitudes change with time. And to be positive and optimistic is always a liability. It has got its merit but it becomes a liability in circumstances such as this one. And I can tell you this (the conflict) never came as a surprise to me.

On Eritrea's policy of frankness and Ethiopia's portrayal of Eritrea's leadership as shrewd and cunning

We have been trustful and frank because we believe that is the best policy. It is the easiest way. .You save time and energy and it is a shortcut for promoting bilateral relationship. I think it is fashionable to talk about diplomacy as an art of telling lies. I have never been persuaded by that attitude and people will talk about Eritreans being naive to always be frank and natural and saying their mind. Our culture which is interpreted as something that has developed during the struggle, which is not true, was to be frank and not to be diplomatic. We adopt policy and approach that our acts need to concur with our policies. To say something on the one hand and do something else that contradicts it on the other hand has never been a part of our tradition. It might be justified with someone you do not consider a partner, but with those we consider to be partners like the TPLF and Ethiopia we were probably more frank and trustful. Now the cunning and shrewd would exploit our naive attitude and tell the international community that we have been cunning. That is not true. No one can prove that. It has never been in our tradition, history.

On Ethiopia's accusation that Eritrea is the aggressor

I have heard a number of comments coming from the Prime Minister and others who have been blaming us of wishing to control Ethiopia, of having an expansionist tendency to influence developments in Ethiopia. I think the history from 1971 to 1991 does clearly prove that we stood for the integrity of Ethiopia, for the well being of the peoples of Ethiopia, all peoples of Ethiopia.

We wanted Ethiopia to be stable politically where all its people would have a share and participate in the daily life of their country. We wanted Ethiopia to prosper and we did contribute substantially towards that end. I do not think we need to brag about that but we constructively were engaged with the TPLF to see that a transition successfully transpires to allow the participation of the peoples of Ethiopia stability and prosperity.

This problem raised by a number of officials is a manifestation of their attitudes Their attempt to assert themselves has been a projection of that very negative attitude. It manifested itself during the 22 years we worked together. I think together we successfully did manage that problem and develop confidence, trust and we worked together to implement joint programs. We were exchanging views, sharing ideas on a number of issues. They have blamed us for wanting to control Ethiopia economically. It is again a very sad thing that they resorted to this cheap propaganda and distort history but facts are there and evidence there to prove that we have never had any intention of dictating our wish on Ethiopia

On the damage caused by the conflict to relationships between the two countries

It is undeniable that it has done a lot of damage. But I always say confident individuals and communities tend to forgive and forget. Those who lose confidence in themselves, individually and in terms of communities, always have this problem of not forgetting and not forgiving. Now it seems that we are not going to forgive and forget. I can tell you this will be forgotten at one point in time and we will be magnanimous enough to forgive even those that have done a lot of damage to our people.

If you preoccupy your mind with something that is irrelevant, if you think about someone which has done a bad thing to you, a lot of damage to your people, even the time you give the thinking is a damage. Forgiving and forgetting comes as a result of not bothering your mind about the past, about something that has been done to you by someone. It is a way of self healing. If you can possibly get rid of that kind of thinking you are healing yourself and I believe that we have developed the tradition, it is part of our culture and there is no reason for us to be trapped in this state of mind. Let us say that a lot of damage has been done. Let us not be presumptuous about what is going to happen in the future. But again let us be realistic and optimistic. I would like to forget this crisis next year or the year after.

On the solution to the conflict

One aspect would be sticking to truth and justice. We believe justice and truth will prevail at the end of the day. Whatever the complications we see these days, the question is simple and its solution does not require any more time and energy. It could be resolved technically without any political complication. If we have controversies as to where the border falls on the ground or on the map we can go for arbitration. There is no complexity in that regard. It is a very simple thing. One document and one agreement will solve the whole problem in no time. Demarcation might not take more than three to six months in my opinion. Arbitration might take some time, but that would make the arrangements more solid and legally binding and relieve future generations from any complications that might arise from border disputes. This is one aspect of the problem, call it political or legal or whatever.

The other aspect is deterrence. Unless there is deterrence our world would be a very wild one where force would be used to intimidate, subjugate and trample upon rights of people here and there. Deterrence is very important. The assumption of the Ethiopian side that they can get away with using force has proved to be a futility in my opinion. Air strikes, fighting on the ground, mobilizing troops, hardware has proved to be a futility because of the deterring force we have that we have used appropriately. Whenever we are attacked we have retaliated appropriately and that has deterred the tendency. Had that not been the case we would have been in a very big problem these days.

But again I would like to emphasize the fact that justice should prevail, and justice would be given prominence under any circumstance. Deterrence or the use of force to deter force will have to come as the last resort but the combination of the two will ultimately bring a solution to this crisis.

On whether the conflict would force the government to move resources into defense and away from development

I can assure you that these days we are more convinced that we need to exert our effort in our developmental programs. It is not sheer emotion. It is not that we have the good will. We are physically doing it. In fact this conflict has come as a blessing in disguise to mobilize our population and forget secondary issues. Very private and individualist issues are shelved for the time being and everyone is working both to defend this nation and not allow any obstruction for the program for development we have been having. And definitely with this energy and with this mobilized manpower and resource we will be doing more on infrastructure program. On the agricultural sector, yes a lot of our efforts will depend on rain but our approach to forgo that factor is proving right because we have done a lot this year. We have mobilized more this year to have its effect next year and definitely we will see in the coming few years a very impacting program implemented on the ground. Other sectors as well will have to sustain some of the damage done by this conflict, but it is going to give us energy to exert as much as we could to not only regain what we have lost during this time of crisis but do more with a more organized human and other resource in the future.

We will never hesitate to or never compromise our program for development for the sake of defense. Our defense expenditure has been very low. It is not going to have any effect on our budget. It is not going to affect our performance as far as growth is concerned. You can imagine how much is being contributed by our people outside this country. The contributions made by citizens of this country locally has been tremendous.

On possible future relations with Ethiopia

We were pragmatic to assume that the TPLF was the only vehicle for transformation in Ethiopia. Was that right, wrong, only history will judge us. But we believed that was the pragmatic approach to the problem and we had to forgo a number other options and work with the TPLF. Economically we wanted to see a transition program that will allow a gradual transformation whereby resources, opportunities and distribution will take account of the gaps that were created all the way in Ethiopia since the end of the last century. We felt politically it is going to be a long process but the TPLF could play a decisive role in allowing all other groups in Ethiopia, the Oromos, Somalis, Afars other nationalities, including the Amharas who had always felt they were superior and they had the right to rule Ethiopia will have to be sobered and come to participate in a meaningful way in Ethiopia. That would be a very long process but ultimately we felt that could contribute to a political stability in the long run.

Now the question is whether that assumption and policy was valid or not. Could it be possible anytime down the road to recover what has been damaged by the conflict and again assume that the TPLF could play the same role? I do not think that we have arrived at a conclusion. But arriving at a conclusion in that regard will change many things and that will influence the bilateral relationships between Ethiopia and Eritrea. We are saying let us not be hasty about this matter. It is not a decision that should be taken emotionally because of the mood now. If we find a solution to this problem, peacefully and legally, if we can overcome some of the difficulties that we have seen in our relationship for the last 22 years we need to frankly talk about what the future holds for all of us and accordingly have to decide on what policies to follow. But whichever way we go, I think that future could be better for bilateral relationships. The assumption might have been based on good will but now we have to make assumptions on realistic considerations.

Despite the gap that might be created and problems that might arise I believe that relationship will go back to normalcy and we will have, if not better, a more realistic and practical relationship with Ethiopia. And above anything else whatever the political considerations, whatever the relationship between political forces, the relationship between the Eritrean and Ethiopian people will have to be cultivated towards a positive thing. We are destined to live like that, we can not possibly change that reality. But again I would like to emphasize that this will have to be based on realistic assumptions not very idealistic approach that we have had in the last seven or 22 years.

On hope for the future

It is not being optimistic unrealistically. I say I m an optimistic. I am a realist. I think this is going to pass and despite the damage it is going to be a very good lesson for everyone here in Eritrea and Ethiopia. That might in a way strengthen future regional cooperation in my opinion because this potential threat has never been taken seriously in the past and we will have learned a lot from this experience and future cooperation programs will be based on a more relatively solid ground Everyone knows that whatever the complications we see today we will find a solution to this problem. It is going to contribute to peace and stability in Ethiopia and Eritrea above anything else. because leaving borders undemarcated and working on the assumption of good will and vision for the future unless supported by some substantive material will not be sustainable. This in my opinion will make any future cooperation between Ethiopia and Eritrea and within the region more sustainable.

On Eritrea's frank, direct and open approach to everything and on this being misconstrued as being "arrogant"

I can tell you one thing about the problems in Africa. It is hypocrisy and pretension that has caused all the problems or mainly problems have not been solved because of the pretension of many leaders and political groups in Africa trying to hide facts and misinform even their populations. Leaders manipulating their population by misinformation and portraying ugly thing as if it is something beautiful and attractive to their peoples. This might have been done in a subtle way on a number of cases but the cumulative effect is what we see in Africa today--Africa marginalized, mismanaged politically, economies mismanaged

I believe our approach has not come as something inherent, as something that we have in our genes. I do not think that has been the case. It is the experience we have gone through all these years. It is the lesson we have learned from the experience of others. There is no other way. We can not continue to misinform and mislead our populations. We can not pretend we are doing well when we are actually getting more and more marginalized. Our approach of dealing with our situations (is) being frank with the population in the first place One strength in this country is the confidence that you can feel and see between the leadership and the population, the transparency that has been all the way the sense of purpose that has developed across the years and the hardworking nature of the population which has come as a result of this very positive approach.

If we wish to continue and pretend that we are the best diplomats, we are doing things fashionably, we are imitating others to solve our problems, that will not get us anywhere. And I can assure you it is not very well appreciated by many. Some might have misunderstood (Eritrea's frank approach to issues) others might have been threatened by that approach. We will continue with our approach because we believe it is the only way we see the future holding anything good for our people.

On the effects of the conflict on IGADD

I can assure you and it is undeniable that both Ethiopia and Eritrea were the dynamo I do not exaggerate if I say that at least we have played a significant role within IGADD. Even reviving IGADD as an idea was initiated by the consultations we have been having on a number of issues. The redefinition of the mandate came as a result of our joint proposals. Our commitment to find a resolution to the crisis in Somalia and again Sudan was a joint effort promoting integration programs economic and otherwise and were initiated by the consultations we have been having. It does not necessarily imply that other partners were not contributing in any way but I think the alliance we had and the team work we had and practiced, entertained all the way was what resulted in what we see IGADD today. And that is one of the damage done by the collapse of this alliance because of this conflict.

A message to the international community

The international community will have to learn many things. Taking this conflict as an example and taking the problems we see in Africa, there is a very cynical approach and attitude on the part of the so called international community. Even the involvement of the international community in a contribution of some sort to solve problems is not appropriate. There are assumptions. You will find people becoming experts in a matter of weeks about matters that would take them years to know better. They would jump into conclusions, have their own distorted approach to solve problems.

We have now human rights issues raised, it is expulsion. . How has the international community reacted to this? Has the international community been very effective and constructive in containing or preventing that from happening? What guarantees do we have that this is not going to happen in the future? People have been talking about conflict resolution and conflict prevention. I have always said these are ideas that apparently look very good but people do not seriously understand what is involved in conflict prevention and resolution. This is a test case. This test case has come for Africa in particular. Africa has been talking about developing a mechanism for conflict resolution and conflict prevention. Where do we stand now? What does this mechanism have to contribute in this conflict?

You can talk about the UN, OAU, international and regional organizations, superpowers influential regional powers, they still live in the past. Especially in Africa, we are talking about a new Africa, a changing Africa, extricating Africa from the situation it is now, marginalized, backward, full of crisis. We have to see a change in Africa and we can not see a change or change situations by entertaining old ideas that definitely will not contribute in resolving this problem. So I would say the international community will not have to talk about change but will have to seriously adjust to change and work towards changing realities.

Vision for the future

The new ideas will have to involve a number of philosophical, political and organizational matters. Each nation will have to have its own unique and independent approach to dealing with its own reality. There are similarities here and there but in Africa, as we are doing in Eritrea and elsewhere, I think we need to have a completely new approach. During the cold war it was either siding with the Soviet Union for opportunistic purpose or with the United States or any other power. That has done a lot of damage to us. Now we need to govern our politics very effectively.

We will have to be able to live in a new era, the 21st century where we need to mobilize our resources and have the rightful place in the international community. If every nation in Africa could do that effectively, I think that would be a dramatic change. The attitude that still prevails, it is a very pretentious thing, the north vs. south, rich/ poor less developed, developed is still a problem. This imbalance, this unfair relationship will have to change internationally. People are talking about new ideas, partnership, equality, mutual respect and all that but this is all on paper. I do not think it is working on the ground. That will have to change. It is not expecting someone to come with those ideas and with the good will to do the change. Every house will have to clean its own backyard.. Unless that happens, I do not think that any change will happen.

To talk about the 21st century, for me it is a change in everything, in all sorts of relationships that prevail. It is a number of things, philosophical, political, economic, organizational, name it. It is a very long shopping list. That might only be a vision for many but for us here in this country because we are very small, we want to survive without anyone bullying us, because we want to change a lot of our living standards in the population in this country we will have to work harder than anyone else. We do not have the luxury to sit around and sit over oil fields and expect that we can live better by exploiting resources underground.

Credit: Elsa Musa
From Dehai.org

---